User talk:Majr/Archive 11

Suggestion for Overwatch AI
Two things, both related to LoadPage:
 * Adding the tag to any loaded pages which lack it.
 * Adjusting the file paths to follow moved master or sub-pages, including changes of path.

The first is more significant -- the category is non-obvious to random editors, and easy to forget when making a subpage. The second is a convenience, especially since a bunch of master pages have recently been renamed, and more will be moved soon. Could this please be added to OWAI's standard "to do" list?--Mental Mouse 21:02, 26 April 2013 (UTC)


 * How would I (automatically) get a list of pages which are loaded with loadPage? –ultradude25 ᐸ Talk Contribs 15:40, 27 April 2013 (UTC)
 * By looking for loadPage calls, which is why this would need the AI. I'm pretty sure the category is meant to produce that "automatic list of pages" -- the problem is, that depends on the writers, and consider that I only found out about the category by watching Munin295. --Mental Mouse 15:54, 27 April 2013 (UTC)


 * Looks like I can use the HTML scraper to get the links, still need to go through each page that transcludes the template manually though. –ultradude25 ᐸ Talk Contribs 00:28, 28 April 2013 (UTC)
 * Oh, right, you can use Special:WhatLinksHere/Template:LoadPage to find the pages that use LoadPage... hmm, that's a rather small list, actually. But anyway, it sounds like you're saying the AI can add the category, but can't handle snapping the links past redirected pages.  Is that right?   --Mental Mouse 01:33, 28 April 2013 (UTC)


 * The closest you could really do is use Special:ListRedirects, and somehow get that list into the find and replace, then just go through Special:AllPages and try to find links that need replacing. –ultradude25 ᐸ Talk Contribs 05:26, 28 April 2013 (UTC)
 * So it can't just scan the pages from LoadPage's WhatLinksHere, pick out the LoadPage paths, and check whether those pages are redirections? Oh well....  As I said, the category thing is what needs the AI more, as that will get worse the more new editors start in with schematics.  For the links, I guess I'll just wait until the next round of moves, then fix the paths. --Mental Mouse 14:08, 28 April 2013 (UTC)


 * For the images, don't bother with moving anything until Curse updates the wiki and we (supposedly) will have our own database separate from the Dutch and German wikis. The amount of coordination needed, as well as working around this by manually uploading a duplicate at a new name, is not worth the end result at this time.  21:47, 1 May 2013 (UTC)
 * I think you're already in on it, but just for the record, LoadBox targets will presumably need the category too. --Mental Mouse 22:59, 11 May 2013 (UTC)

Patrolling pages that have been moved without a redirect
Since I've started lurking the newpages list, it has annoyed me to no end that I couldn't mark a moved page as patrolled and it just sits there highlighted in the list. Earlier this week, I randomly decided to try putting the rcid in the url of the "deleted" page into the url of the moved page and I got the patrol link in the new page, which when clicked, marked the original page as patrolled. I was actually surprised and then went through the whole first page and cleared the highlights. MediaWiki is weird. Anyways, would it be possible to have a script that appends the link to the new page in the deleted message with the rcid of the deleted page? Better yet, would it be possible to force the patrol link onto the deleted page? 21:01, 1 May 2013 (UTC)


 * Well I'll need an unpatrolled moved page to test with, so don't patrol the next one you see.
 * Assuming there is no way to know the page has been deleted beforehand, it'll require an API request to get the token so a patrol link can be made. The other way would be to redirect it to the new page name with the id in the url so you can use that link. –ultradude25 ᐸ Talk Contribs 07:16, 2 May 2013 (UTC)


 * Alright I've added a script to the sysop js. You should see that the link to the new page in the log has an rcid on it now. –ultradude25 ᐸ Talk Contribs 01:15, 4 May 2013 (UTC)


 * Works great. Thank you!  20:08, 4 May 2013 (UTC)

Locked Chest 13w18a
Well, It got changed. We need a render of --007a83 (Talk&#124;Contribs) 07:35, 9 May 2013 (UTC)


 * Thank you.--007a83 (Talk&#124;Contribs) 14:21, 9 May 2013 (UTC)


 * We also need a render of Stained Hardened Clay. -- Numbermaniac  - T  - C 02:14, 11 May 2013 (UTC)

you.
I like how you didn't even give me time to talk. Also, my userpage, is MY userpage. Please don't go deleting all my stuff I did on MY userpage, or talk. You also deleted all my stuff which took hours to do. Everyone, please be warned, this admin is a bad admin, he don't give two shits what you do, ANY good edits you do will be deleted by him. –Preceding unsigned comment was added by Andrew Powers (Talk&#124;Contribs) 17:52, 11 May 2013 (UTC). Please sign your posts with


 * I have only deleted templates which you created outside of your userspace, as well as the images they were using.
 * I even gave you a warning to stop spamming the templates but you continued on, then I gave you a second warning that I would going to remove them and waited 10 minutes before doing anything.
 * The thing that amazes me the most about this is how you seem so surprised that spamming personal templates on a wiki you've only just recently joined would result in them being deleted. Having terrible templates on your userpage isn't required for you to make constructive edits on the wiki. –ultradude25 ᐸ Talk Contribs 18:09, 11 May 2013 (UTC)


 * That was a bit rude Andrew... -- Numbermaniac  - T  - C 01:05, 12 May 2013 (UTC)

javascript and wiki template
Is it possible for javascript to use a wiki template that contains a #switch function? —Powup333  ZH Admin  21:00, 11 May 2013 (UTC)


 * I don't really know what you mean... If you mean "use" as in: "can JavaScript parse a wiki template?" Then no, not at all. JavaScript has no knowledge of mediawiki markup. You could port mediawiki's parser from PHP to JavaScript, but that would probably take months considering the complexity and hacked-togetherness of it. –ultradude25 ᐸ Talk Contribs 21:36, 16 May 2013 (UTC)


 * Ah, okay. I was planning to have the JavaScript that does the Grid animations to use the template for the image link, guess that won't work. So I guess I will have to pass a new variable to the js and edit the js a bit...but I don't think the variables extension accept Chinese characters...any suggestions?—Powup333  ZH Admin  01:50, 20 May 2013 (UTC)


 * Wait for lua. Then there's no issues. –ultradude25 ᐸ Talk Contribs 03:04, 20 May 2013 (UTC)


 * Timeframe? &mdash;Munin295 &middot; Grid_Book_and_Quill.png Grid_Stone_Pickaxe.png &middot; 05:33, 20 May 2013 (UTC)


 * When every other curse wiki has hydra, then we get it. –ultradude25 ᐸ Talk Contribs 05:37, 20 May 2013 (UTC)

Tutorials
Please see talk page.--Minecraft5025 (MC5025) (Talk! Contributions!) 12:09, 13 May 2013 (UTC)


 * For the third time in two days, just click add topic to add a new section! -- Numbermaniac  - T  - C 05:36, 14 May 2013 (UTC)

Crazy nav template idea
I know we're on the cusp of converting everything to use LoadBox, but I just had an interesting idea that involves the use of the MediaWiki system messages. Thinking about the msgbox I tinkered with for talk pages, its usage isn't on actual pages. If I were to transclude a template onto a system message (which is possible, I reviewed talknotice in there, but thought it wasn't a good idea to have a publicly editable template in a system message) the template will display, but no massive cache updates occur if it were edited, since system messages don't load that way. If some css or js trickery were used to shift a div or something in a system message from the top to the bottom of a page, and some type of #switch (or upcoming lua function) were used to display a specific nav template based on the page, would it be possible to display the nav templates using the article space system message? This way, we can have the templates transcluded in the system message instead of the page and have them editable without the cache update problems. If we used the #switch function, we would probably have to have some kind of special support template like the position subpages of the sprite templates where the code would be formatted in a long list of blocks/items/etc and have the #switch compare it to the pagename magic word or something. The only downside I can think of is if #switch has limits or if using a massive list of block/item/etc names in a #switch has performance issues. Please excuse me if this is actually crazy. 06:13, 15 May 2013 (UTC)


 * I don't think that will work. As far as I know, even the simple parser functions and templates we already use in system messages is a terrible thing we shouldn't be doing. –ultradude25 ᐸ Talk Contribs 21:26, 16 May 2013 (UTC)

Apple
The fact notch drops an apple is not a primary way to get an apple and should be removed especially since that fact is already in trivia, and it says "four" ways to get an apple. Rcmaehl 00:43, 19 May 2013 (UTC)


 * That's fine, but it's not in any way vandalism like you claimed. –ultradude25 ᐸ Talk Contribs 00:45, 19 May 2013 (UTC)


 * True, however at the time I believed it was. After I found out, I thought it was not a primary way and really shouldn't be added back so I left it that way. Still, the apple page needs to lose the Notch way, or be edited to say 5 reasons to keep the info from conflicting. Rcmaehl 00:49, 19 May 2013 (UTC)


 * –ultradude25 ᐸ Talk Contribs 01:01, 19 May 2013 (UTC)

Question mark in a wikilink
Hello ultradude,

Is it possible to use a question mark in a wikilink (double-bracket) without it turning into %3F and making the wiki assume that the quesiton mark is part of the title even though I'm trying to use it as a query? Thanks! –- (T) Numbermaniac (C) 01:28, 26 May 2013 (UTC)


 * No. Use fullurl. –ultradude25 ᐸ Talk Contribs 01:30, 26 May 2013 (UTC)


 * Darn. Thanks! –- (T) Numbermaniac (C) 01:33, 26 May 2013 (UTC)

Templates and snapshots
With your latest edit of ItemSprite, the charcoal image has been changed to that used in the 1.6 snapshots. Let me quote a section of the style guide:


 * These guidelines also apply for new snapshot releases. Snapshot changes should not be included into the main sections until the full update is released. These new changes should be in a Future section to prevent current users of the full release from confusing new features with the current ones. After the full update is released, then the previous info can be deleted and previous differences moved into the History section. The snapshot features/changes can then be incorporated into the main sections.

I think we should handle snapshot changes in templates similarly: add them to the templates to allow documentation of the upcoming changes, but not let them get mixed up with the latest version of Minecraft. People are confused enough about snapshots and releases, we don't need to add to that confusion by having a mix of latest-release and latest-snapshot in the templates.

I'd like to hear your opinion about this. There has to be a better approach to this than what I did on ItemSprite. —Fenhl 01:29, 28 May 2013 (UTC)


 * The issue with the sprite templates is if we have that id and people start using it, when the update comes out we either have to find all usage of the id and change them, or keep the extra name in there; which means we're going to end up with a bunch of redundant ids. –ultradude25 ᐸ Talk Contribs 01:54, 28 May 2013 (UTC)


 * A possible solution would be to add an additional parameter to the template that is used for upcoming sprites. Using this parameter would add a category to the article in addition to using the new textures. —Fenhl 02:46, 28 May 2013 (UTC)


 * That could work, but it would need to be automatic based on the name. You can't rely on people adding the extra parameter. –ultradude25 ᐸ Talk Contribs 02:56, 28 May 2013 (UTC)

Moving Pages/Files
I thought that Autoconfirmed users had the perms to move pages and files. But this is what I receive. "Permissions errors You do not have permission to do that, for the following reason: You do not have permission to move files." or can Autoconfirmed users only move pages.?--007a83 (Talk&#124;Contribs) 15:45, 28 May 2013 (UTC)


 * Moving pages is different than moving files. Pages are fine and autoconfirmed users can move pages, but files can only be moved by an admin. Moving files at this time is not a good idea anyways due to our shared database with the Dutch and German wikis. We have enough issues as it is with them messing with files without us causing issues too. (addition) If you were talking about that spider jockey image, I verified that the other two wikis weren't using it and then renamed it.  18:10, 28 May 2013 (UTC)


 * It was AHmYu.png]] and [[File:Lockedchest.png.--007a83 (Talk&#124;Contribs) 20:52, 28 May 2013 (UTC)

Helping out with the Server Tutorial
Hey there, I wanted to add a helpful video to the Server Tutorial. It was blocked because it was the first time I tried to edit anything on the wiki. Could you take a look and let me know if it is something that would be worth adding?

I can't add a real link in here since I get the same block message, so the unlinked link is www (dot) youtube (dot) com/watch?v=RGkrLW_Jk50

TheJohnnyK TheJohnnyK 23:01, 29 May 2013 (UTC)


 * I can't watch videos, but I've added it in good faith. –ultradude25 ᐸ Talk Contribs 23:21, 29 May 2013 (UTC)


 * Much appreciated.--TheJohnnyK 23:52, 29 May 2013 (UTC)

Common.js edit
Having the page loader parse pages as templates is generally good. However, it broke LoadPage whenever it's used to load a page in the main namespace. For example, attempts to load Template:Crafting/Basic instead of Crafting/Basic. Is there a more elegant solution than adding colons to all of these situations to force the main namespace? -- Orthotope talk 18:58, 2 June 2013 (UTC)


 * Perhaps use an if statement to check whether such a template exists? And then go to the main namespace if no template is found? –- (T) Numbermaniac (C) 22:00, 2 June 2013 (UTC)


 * This change has also broken all the LoadBoxes in the circuit articles.
 * &mdash;Munin295 &middot; Grid_Book_and_Quill.png Grid_Stone_Pickaxe.png &middot; 22:22, 2 June 2013 (UTC)


 * Oh yeah, I didn't think about that. I'll just add a colon to the script. –ultradude25 — Contribs 23:33, 2 June 2013 (UTC)

Hardware performance
What do you think will happen to this page? Do we have to get rid of it just because Mojang doesn't use it? –- (T) Numbermaniac (C) 05:20, 7 June 2013 (UTC)


 * We don't have to do anything. But why waste time maintaining a page that isn't used and has no encyclopaedic information? –ultradude25 05:22, 7 June 2013 (UTC)


 * Becuase it shows, in general, how well Minecraft is faring on different computers? –- (T) Numbermaniac (C) 05:45, 7 June 2013 (UTC)


 * It shows how minecraft is running on specific computers. That not very useful as the possible combinations of hardware/software are massive, not even taking into account faults or modifications like overclocking. At best, someone might be able to find one or two configurations similar to their own, whose results may be wildly inaccurate. So that limits the usefulness of this page to developers wanting to see trends in performance change across versions, and track down specific hardware that is getting really bad results. Since Mojang already have the snoop data thing, which I wouldn't be surprised included things like performance, it's not actually useful to anyone.
 * For it to be useful to users, it would need general information on the kind of hardware that is verified as capable of running Minecraft, and how well. A large table of independent reports with specific hardware configurations isn't that. –ultradude25 06:17, 7 June 2013 (UTC)


 * That... was a very long answer.
 * Does that mean we don't need to worry about the proposed changes? –- (T) Numbermaniac (C) 06:43, 7 June 2013 (UTC)


 * Only once we know we are going to keep the page, and to do that we need to know if Mojang uses it. –ultradude25 06:50, 7 June 2013 (UTC)


 * Darn, it was going to be fun. Thanks. –- (T) Numbermaniac (C) 06:56, 7 June 2013 (UTC)

Template:OS
Hi, I see you want my edits reverted. Here are a few things.

First, I am not some random newcomer; I've worked with wikis for 5 years now. One thing I've learned is that these little icons should not be placed like so, because "alt" is not going to help with mobile users and not many PC users use it. Not just that, alt ruins the formatting and makes the page look like "Android iOS Xbox 360", etc. Also, just placing images makes the images seem out-of-scale. I've viewed all the pages that use the OS template and they are just fine... I don't see an issue related to "not enough space". I have reverted your undo again. Please talk to me on my talk page before anything else. Thanks.

--Jeffw 14:55, 8 June 2013 (UTC)


 * No one has reported an issue with the icons for the years that template has existed. We could leave it and try it, but the text is just redundant. Alt text is displayed when images aren't, mobiles should support that since it's been a feature of the web since forever. –ultradude25 15:17, 8 June 2013 (UTC)
 * True, but on Wikipedia I've always seen them put text, and along with the rest of the internet. It just looks better. Without the text the images are out of proportion. Let's give it a try, and if nobody else reverts it in 30 days, we'll keep it as such. -- Jeffw  (talk) (contribs) 15:24, 8 June 2013 (UTC)


 * This isn't Wikipedia; we don't have to do things the same way as them. Having both images and text is cramped and looks bad on pages such as Programs and editors/Mapping. -- Orthotope talk 18:51, 8 June 2013 (UTC)
 * I'll work on a "lite" and a "full" version, in the meanwhile, please hold on tight until I get this done. -- Jeffw  (talk) (contribs) 20:36, 8 June 2013 (UTC)
 * Done with the lite and full versions, the lite is at Template:OSM. Can someone use AWB to convert the pages that need it or can someone give me AWB access and let me make a bot account? Thanks. -- Jeffw  (talk) (contribs) 21:09, 8 June 2013 (UTC)


 * This is just silly. You've changed the template, now you want us to go around and change it to a different template to get back what we originally had... Here's a better idea, I'll just change the original back to what works fine for every page. –ultradude25 04:10, 9 June 2013 (UTC)

Vandalism warning templates?
Do we have any on the wiki? -- Jeffw  (talk) (contribs) 15:24, 8 June 2013 (UTC)


 * Well there's uw-vandalism, but it's just a carbon copy from wikipedia. –ultradude25 15:33, 8 June 2013 (UTC)

Move zombie siege to siege?
There is clear consensus on the page Talk:Zombie_siege to move the page to siege. Please help, thanks. -- Jeffw  (talk) (contribs) 21:21, 8 June 2013 (UTC)

Lowercasing the first letter in your username
Just a suggestion, why don't you  your name in common.css? — Hower64 09:35, 14 June 2013 (UTC)


 * Why would I do that when I can just write it in lowercase...? –ultradude25 09:58, 14 June 2013 (UTC)


 * Page history, recent changes etc. I meant like   — Hower64 10:00, 14 June 2013 (UTC)


 * Well I suppose so, hadn't thought about it. –ultradude25 12:17, 14 June 2013 (UTC)


 * I meant on the site-wide common.css. Sort of pointless otherwise isn't it? — Hower64 12:28, 14 June 2013 (UTC)


 * You're kidding right? Adding personal styling to everyone's css... jeez –ultradude25 13:13, 14 June 2013 (UTC)


 * It's not "personal styling"; it just fixes the problem of the software not recognizing names with lowercased first letters. I've seen another wiki do it (not that that makes it acceptable, I'm just showing you that the notion is not as ridiculous as you think). If you're adamant about it then that's fine with me, I was only trying to help you. — Hower64 13:49, 14 June 2013 (UTC)


 * It is personal styling. It only affects me. And as soon as you start adding site-wide personal styles, then you're opening the floodgates for everyone else to start asking for their own personal styling. It's also a pretty stuck up thing to do, as if you're more important. –ultradude25 13:56, 14 June 2013 (UTC)


 * ...Except that this personal styling only fixes a problem in the software, it doesn't make your name special in any way. I don't see how anybody could look at a styling that lowercases the first letter in your name because of the software not recognizing it and start asking for their name to be in green or something. What could actually happen is people could start asking for their names to be lowercased as well. I see how that could cause a problem if too many people starting asking, which I guess is enough reason not to do it. — Hower64 12:14, 16 June 2013 (UTC)


 * And it would only be fixing that "software problem" for my name, the very definition of making it special... –ultradude25 13:01, 16 June 2013 (UTC)

I never said that only you would be allowed. I thought it was obvious that other people would be allowed as well. — Hower64 13:15, 16 June 2013 (UTC)


 * That's irrelevant. It has to be done on a case-by-case basis, it's not just a general fix that will apply to everyone. So even when you let other people have their names added, they're still going to be a special group of people. –ultradude25 13:18, 16 June 2013 (UTC)


 * Okay, but why does that matter? My point still stands; people would only start ask for their name to be added to the list, nothing else. — Hower64 13:47, 16 June 2013 (UTC)


 * It's not fair for everyone. What about someone that wants underscores in their name, for instance? Additionally, everyone has to download this extra styling and it's another thing that we would have to maintain. –ultradude25 14:04, 16 June 2013 (UTC)


 * Alright, fair enough. — Hower64 10:57, 23 June 2013 (UTC)

"Bin" section on the template
Hi ultradude, how can i add the bin section on the template (For example the "Food" template") in the "data value" section? I've tried to add it by updating the template but i've no result. Can you help me with this "update"? Thanks in advance ;) --Raffox97 it.Wiki Admin 05:19, 16 June 2013 (UTC)


 * Update dv and create dec-bin. –ultradude25 07:58, 16 June 2013 (UTC)

I hold administrators to a higher moral standard
I created a template called helpme. I know very well that its inefficient but it's how they do it on Wikipedia and its simple. If you had done any looking you would have realized that it was simply a mirror of something I had tested in my userspace. I include it in my Welcome templates so I can give help faster to new users.

So on to why I am complaining, you made a cleanup edit. Normally a user with a sense of respect for other lables their cleanup 'Cleaned template code' and such. You said;

(What's with this space wasting msgbox that doesn't match the rest of the msgboxes, and has a bunch of extra /div tags? Either way, I doubt this will be used. Categories are a terrible way to notify people of things needing attention.).

The messed code was to make it harder to use and vandalize and the extra div tags were to close any test the users had made on their talk page. I am not stupid, I consider myself quite competent. One thing I don't tolerate is edit summary fights. If you have a problem say it to my face. I hold administrators in general to a higher moral standard. I won't watch this page because I don't have the time and to be honest I couldn't care less. If you have something to say tell me on my talk. <font style="white-space:nowrap;text-shadow:#08088A 0.4em 0.4em 1.7em,#58ACFA -0.1em -0.1em 1.5em;color:#2E64FE"><font color="#2E64FE">Falkirks <font color="#000000">Talk  21:28, 22 June 2013 (UTC)


 * "How they do it on Wikipedia" is not a valid excuse to do something. You can have templates in your user space look however you want, but you copied the template to the template space, so it should match the style of other templates, not have a oversized image and different style "because Wikipedia."
 * Cleaned template code isn't a good summary. It doesn't explain why its being changed at all.
 * Harder to use and vandalize? Extra div tags to close tests? Those are terrible excuses and you said just before that you did it because it was simple. Make up your mind.
 * You couldn't care less, yet you clearly care enough to make a comment here. From what I've seen of your edits and especially your talk page edits, you seem very full of yourself, and quite "snobby" to other people. –ultradude25 22:56, 22 June 2013 (UTC)


 * I love being respectful or as you put it snobby but I would never make a personal attack against another user through an edit summary. I was browsing around and found even more of your nasty edit summaries. Cleaned template code is a far better summary than not talking about any changes and just say things like What is this doing here?. You also called my excuses terrible, why exactly is this? Also to conclude your final argument was an unrelated attack regarding my editing attitude on the wiki as a whole and not this incident. This clearly shows how incivil some of the admins are. I really couldn't care less about your actions but I feel bound to correctly alert all users of their malefactions and other incivil behaviour. As to my badly pharased statement "because they do it on Wikipedia" I ammend it to "becuase this process is done on systems with many many times the amount of users. These systems retain new users by providing help services like this one." Your administration could learn a lot about being civil and helpful. Well actually not all of them, mostly you :) Have a nice day and thanks for your time. <font style="white-space:nowrap;text-shadow:#08088A 0.4em 0.4em 1.7em,#58ACFA -0.1em -0.1em 1.5em;color:#2E64FE"><font color="#2E64FE">Falkirks <font color="#000000">Talk  15:15, 23 June 2013 (UTC)


 * Harder to use was my badly made attempt to prevent you admins from altering it like you did. Well it sto late for that. The extra div tags are incredibly useful. It was a good gesture to clean it up though. <font style="white-space:nowrap;text-shadow:#08088A 0.4em 0.4em 1.7em,#58ACFA -0.1em -0.1em 1.5em;color:#2E64FE"><font color="#2E64FE">Falkirks <font color="#000000">Talk  15:17, 23 June 2013 (UTC)


 * You have a strange definition of respectful. How is that a better summary? It doesn't say why it should be cleaned. Making a template more difficult to use is a bad excuse because it doesn't make sense, the purpose of templates it to make things easier and quicker. Making it harder to vandalise? That's a bad excuse because you can make the code as lengthy or convoluted as you like, and it'll be just as easy to blank it or other such vandalism. The extra closing div tags? Why do you expect people to have random unclosed div tags at the top of their page before any message box templates? And why div? They could just as easily have unclosed tables or spans or any other thing. Regardless, it's not a message box template's job to cleanup after people and it's more likely to break things than fix them. That's assuming it even does anything in the first place. HTMLTidy probably just deletes them.
 * If you want to get along with people, just tell them outright what the issue is and don't act all condescending with your messages, otherwise that's all you're going to get in return.
 * Also I thought you didn't have time to watch this page? –ultradude25 04:20, 24 June 2013 (UTC)


 * Oh hahaha I can watch whatever I want. I didn't have the time to add it to my Watchlist. I don't have a strange definition of respectful. I use the standard definition as provided in the Oxford English Dictionary. I commend you for backing up your points with good evidence. It was really my fault for making the template messed up but you should have said that you cleaned up the div tags or something instead of insulting it. Trust me I hold civility and quality of wiki and the information contained in it above "getting along" with others. Please keep this in mind in future and I will remember that you massacre new templates. Have a nice day it was a pleasure to talk with you! <font style="white-space:nowrap;text-shadow:#08088A 0.4em 0.4em 1.7em,#58ACFA -0.1em -0.1em 1.5em;color:#2E64FE"><font color="#2E64FE">Falkirks <font color="#000000">Talk  17:37, 24 June 2013 (UTC)


 * This over exaggeration and critical levels of sarcasm are exactly the kind of thing I'm talking about. Are you really this oblivious to your own attitude? –ultradude25 22:07, 24 June 2013 (UTC)


 * I try to never be sarcastic on wikis it only hurts the meaning of my posts. I was dead serious about the above. Funny that you found it sarcastic though. The last bit is just a thing civil people do if you were wondering. As for over exaggeration that is your POV. Of course I am oblivious to your interpretation of my attitude, that's why you shared it isn't it? I am sad to find that you find me sarcastic it was never my intention. I also don't understand "exactly the kind of thing I'm talking about." I though I was disscussing your edit on my template. Nevertheless I will continue to do what I was doing and keep in mind to always obsicifute my templates as they are mine and I like them that way. <font style="white-space:nowrap;text-shadow:#08088A 0.4em 0.4em 1.7em,#58ACFA -0.1em -0.1em 1.5em;color:#2E64FE"><font color="#2E64FE">Falkirks <font color="#000000">Talk   22:24, 24 June 2013 (UTC)


 * Then don't put any templates into the template space, otherwise you'll find they will be "massacred." –ultradude25 22:28, 24 June 2013 (UTC)