Talk:Java Edition data values/Archive 3

Page content restructuring
This page is way too long imo. Wouldn't it be more practical if the data/damage values of specific blocks and items were described in their respective articles? We could still link to them from the block/item ID table. —Fenhl 11:15, 28 July 2012 (UTC)


 * I agree, and I've been considering doing something like this for awhile now. Putting the data values in the respective articles of the items they describe may not be best, though, since in some cases the same data values apply to more than one item. --Celtic Minstrel 23:57, 17 December 2012 (UTC)


 * For starters, the ID colouring system seems to have gotten overly complex. It's now trying to cover several aspects of how items can be obtained:
 * With the /give command (or inventory editors); true for everything except air
 * In Creative mode via the item list
 * In Creative mode via block picking
 * By trading with villagers
 * By using enchanted tools
 * The default (a black ID) is presumably something like "can be obtained by mining, crafting, or killing mobs". I think it would be sufficient to reduce this to two basic things: "obtainable in Survival", and "obtainable in Creative"; that means four colours including black. Air is a single exception, so I don't think it really needs a colour of its own. Still, if others disagree, that's five colours. Then other aspects of availability (item list vs block picking, enchanted tools vs villagers vs regular tools) can perhaps be indicated in some other way. Not sure how though.
 * I'm currently working on a page that could go at IDs (which currently redirects here); the idea would be for the ID lists to be moved there while leaving the data values (or at least an index to them) on this page. (This page would of course link to the IDs page.) Some of the data values could also be split out into subpages (especially potions).
 * Any thoughts on either of these points? --Celtic Minstrel 00:52, 18 December 2012 (UTC)
 * In-progress split here. --Celtic Minstrel 03:00, 18 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Unless I have some feedback by, say, the end of December, I'm probably going to go ahead and just make this change. Basically, this amounts to moving the page linked above to IDs, removing the corresponding info from this page, and also some reorganization of this page. --Celtic Minstrel 19:42, 24 December 2012 (UTC)


 * I have added a section to the style guide talk about moving the data values descriptions. —Fenhl 02:39, 28 May 2013 (UTC)


 * As of today ( 28 Sep 2013 ) page is reorganized and for me whole usefulness is lost. All suggestions above does not give any single reason why such change must be done. My assumption is that as web development theory says - "page must be compact and scrolling should be avoided because users lost interest" ( this is not exact quote, it's my interpretation ). If we dissect above statement it has few points - 1st it was written long time ago when Internet was slow and huge pages take for ever to load. This is no more true. 2nd 'loosing interest' applies to boring data - say endless 'how great is my idea'. This page is about one of the most innovative game at this time, you can't lose interest. This wiki is for beginners mainly and having information at one place it is easier - say I have block ..ok let's see what else can I relate to it ... something for digging, something for storing, something for moving, something for covering, other for combining .. I can't even find newly reorganized articles and I know what I am searching. Do some of the folks above have any complain about 'old' page ? /* sorry for being too detailed. */--Ardour80 (talk) 21:06, 27 September 2013 (UTC)


 * The article was split up because the new servers can't handle such a large page -- it was timing out. It's possible that once the migration issues are settled, the new servers may be able to handle it again, but until then, something was needed.


 * I started a discussion below about what's the best way to split it up.


 * &mdash;munin &middot; Grid_Book_and_Quill.png Grid_Stone_Pickaxe.png &middot; 21:18, 27 September 2013 (UTC)

Lily pad facing direction
I would like to know which bit telly you in which direction the lily pad's facing does anybody know that? thx for your help --Rebio 16:49, 17 September 2012 (UTC)


 * There isn't one; lily pads' orientation depends on their location. Other than that, I don't know the specifics of how it works. 「 ディノ 奴 千？！ 」? · ☎ Dinoguy1000 01:14, 18 September 2012 (UTC)


 * And how can you tell by its location in which direction it is located?
 * Is there any (secret) rule fot that?
 * --Rebio 16:53, 19 September 2012 (UTC)


 * "Other than that, I don't know the specifics of how it works." Try the Lily Pad article. 「 ディノ 奴 千？！ 」? · ☎ Dinoguy1000 03:07, 20 September 2012 (UTC)

I believe the biome affects the orientation. I haven't figured it out. Erich666 00:50, 1 October 2012 (UTC)
 * Not true. No matter in which biome you are in (or even it's a different world) the orientation is only bound to the the lily pads position in the grid. So eg. 0/100/0 has the same orientation no matter which biome you are in or world seed was used
 * --Rebio 20:56, 31 March 2013 (UTC)

Wither Skeleton EID
I don't see an Entity ID for wither skeletons, though 65 is missing. I understand that they share a lot of things with skeletons, but they must be defined differently somehow. Whatever the case, it should either be in the EID table, or explained nearby. Cultist O 12:11, 1 January 2013 (UTC)


 * Wither skeletons have the same entity ID as regular skeletons; an internal flag is used to keep track of which type it is. ID 65 is the bat, listed slightly out of order to preserve a nice distinction between hostile and passive mobs. -- Orthotope 12:48, 1 January 2013 (UTC)

Redstone Comparator (active vs. inactive)
I just played a bit with Minecrafts code and now I have a question of which I hope someone else can answer it. The Redstone Comparator has an ID of 149 (Inactive) and 150 (Active). It seems to me that the Redstone Comparator is NEVER active. The 'active' redstone comparator (I call it active when it has the red light glowing in the middle) is not 150 but rather the "1" bit of 0x8 ("0" is an inactive/not powered/no red light glowing comparator). This is not the case with redstone repeaters where there are two different ID for active and non-active. Do I just miss something or is there really something crazy going on in the code of MC? cheers, Rebio (20:53, 31 March 2013 (UTC))

Entity IDs
Why are firework rockets located in Blocks? Shouldn't they be in Immobile & Projectiles? --GreenStone(cont) (ru.Wiki Admin) 19:30, 1 April 2013 (UTC)

stained hardend clay 159
add please. --209.188.41.111 19:08, 10 May 2013 (UTC)
 * Already did. didn't make a new data value section, because its the same as wool.  Firebastard 13:00, 11 May 2013 (UTC)

Crops with data in inventory
maybe this is the wrong place to be putting this but I'm trying to get crops (the block) in my inventory, in each of its stages. I've only been able to spawn it as its first stage... Every plugin has disallowed it in any other stages (they are all textured to be items). Is it even possible to hold Crops:5 etc. in the inventory? If so, how can it be done?! 184.58.229.224 01:03, 21 July 2013 (UTC)


 * I suppose the principle applies that blocks which cannot be acquired with metadata in regular gameplay also can't be held in inventory with a damage value other than 0. --☺ Sven ? ! 20:36, 21 July 2013 (UTC)
 * I have been trying to do this as well. Is it just not something that can be done? Like, a vanilla restriction?   Cossacksson   | Page |  Talk |  Cont |  00:50, 22 July 2013 (UTC)


 * Seems to be. Even when I set the data value with an NBT editor, it doesn't show up in-game. -- Orthotope talk 02:04, 22 July 2013 (UTC)
 * That's disappointing. I was hoping to be able to utilize the textures of the growth stages for a custom map/resource pack duo.   Cossacksson   | Page |  Talk |  Cont |  09:09, 27 July 2013 (UTC)

New Potions
Would someone add the damage values for the new potions? e.g Potion of Health Boost. Yes, those potions exist--- Tonkku107 (User Page|Talk) 07:26, 12 August 2013 (UTC)

Stone Brick DV's
From testing using /give, the Stone Brick ID's for Mossy and Cracked bricks are backward. Seemingly /give player 98:1 = Mossy, 98:2 = Cracked unlike what is stated on the page. Can anybody else confirm? [Chozo4] 70.127.216.53 05:13, 29 August 2013 (UTC)


 * Confirmed, fixed. -- Orthotope talk 05:52, 29 August 2013 (UTC)

Update
The new biome ID's aren't in the biome ID table, please fix Mokiki 19:24, 5 September 2013 (UTC)

It was fixed Mokiki 04:23, 8 September 2013 (UTC)

Article split
Some aspects of the recent split need cleaning up, but there seems to have been very little discussion preceding this split so I don't know what the end goal is here. Is it the intent that other ID sections also be moved to subpages? Should item data value details be moved to Data values/Item IDs, etc.?

There was a discussion about moving the IDs to IDs, and there was a discussion about transcluding block/item data value details into their own articles, but I don't see anything about moving ID sections to subpages.

Personally I find it very useful to have all the ID tables on a single page, and having the data value details right on the same page is also convenient. Is this split necessary?

&mdash;munin &middot;  &middot; 21:11, 26 September 2013 (UTC)


 * Okay, I found the impetus for the split. Alright, if a split is necessary, let's consider how all this should be organized.


 * 1. By data structure
 * Put all the ids in IDs and leave data values in Data values.
 * 2. By in-game type
 * Move block ids and data values to Blocks (there are already a lot of block ids there), item info to Items (almost a stub article right now), entity info to Entities. Biome, Enchanting, and Status effect already contain the information here. Leave data values as a stub navigation.


 * I like #2 myself. Any other ideas?


 * &mdash;munin &middot; Grid_Book_and_Quill.png Grid_Stone_Pickaxe.png &middot; 23:09, 26 September 2013 (UTC)


 * I would favor #2 as well. Since the style guide was updated to include a Data values section for articles on blocks and items, it would be unnecessary to have them on this page as well. They just need to be moved over first. —F‌enhl 06:33, 28 September 2013 (UTC)


 * Third (obvious) option:
 * 3. Retain current organization
 * Just use LoadBoxes in data values to allow readers to load the ID info they want. This is the current trend and isn't too bad.
 * I'm kind of hoping that these server issues will be reduced with further patches (we're currently on MediaWiki 1.19, and I'm expecting us to get at least to 1.21 within a few months), which may allow us to put the article back the way it was before the migration.
 * &mdash;munin &middot; Grid_Book_and_Quill.png Grid_Stone_Pickaxe.png &middot; 18:17, 28 September 2013 (UTC)


 * The use of many complicated templates is what is bringing us down. Lua will greatly reduce this issue. –Matt ᐸ Talk Contribs ⎜ 21:04, 28 September 2013 (UTC)

The parts that take up the most space ("block data") are the parts that have been left as part of the normal page, while the more often used (I would imagine, at least) parts (basic block/item IDs) have been put into annoying click to load things. I would think the other way round would be better. Also, do we really need "minecraft:" to be there for every block/item name? It's always the same, so just mention that at the top. That would save a lot of space and make it more readable (closer to the nice compact format it had before the names were added...) Bah 19:11, 21 October 2013 (UTC)