Talk:Dirt/Archive 1

Dirt as a sign of minerals
in caverns dirt is a sign of iron ore, and gravel is a sign of coal. this can be prooved by digging dirt that is inside caves. –The preceding unsigned comment was added by Coolguy3867 (Talk 00:29, 22 January 2011. Please sign your posts with   !
 * That's purely random, Dirt and Gravel are no bullet proof indicators for minerals. I dug out pockets of Gravel and found Iron, dug out Dirt and found Coal, or nothing, or Diamond. It's completely random. --Flippeh 23:34, 21 January 2011 (UTC)

Sunlight for grass
"When a Dirt block is adjacent to a Grass-covered block and is exposed to sunlight, it will eventually be converted into a Grass block" I know this is incorrect as I have used torches to walk grass down into caves before. I'll run a test later to check what level the light needs to be then change it.


 * No need, the details are in the Light article. That said, the statement wasn't false, it was just misleading.  Sunlight will do it, but so will torchlight, lava, glowstone, etc.  --Theothersteve7 14:29, 22 April 2011 (UTC)

Updating the Dirt page
I think we need a picture of a dirt block, converted into farmland. Isn't there any trivia about the dirt block? Like it's the icon of Minecraft on the desktop and stuff? –The preceding unsigned comment was added by Herkio (Talk 21:28, 25 August 2011. Please sign your posts with
 * We have a farmland page, you can see pics there. And the icon of Minecraft is a grass block, not dirt.--Cby 12:02, 25 August 2011 (UTC)

New Layout
In accordance with the template given here, I have completely redone this page. It can be found here. If it is alright, I'd like to copy the changes over. Let me know what you think. --Harrison (talk) 18:57, 14 May 2012 (UTC)

More information
I want to know more about how dirt is generated. How many layers of dirt are usually on the surface, above stone? Is this affected by the biome or altitude? How big, on average, are dirt lodes underground? And do they replace ores and lead to short veins? Do they signify nearby caves, or is this random? We also need some information on other ways dirt is generated, such as on the floor of the "dirt room" in abandoned mineshafts.
 * I'll try to answer as many of those as possible, but anyone feel free to correct me if I am wrong:

#trigger_hurt (I 14:50, 28 January 2013 (UTC)
 * 1. Typically, 3 layers of dirt are present and 1 layer of grass, but on occasion 2 layers of dirt and 1 of grass (such as on default superflat worlds)
 * 2. Not by altitude, but biome does matter. I'm not sure which biomes dirt generates more or less in (except deserts which generate no dirt at all)*3. If you mean the large random dirt piles located within the rock, they tend to have around 1-2.5 stacks of dirt inside
 * 4. As far as I can tell, the ores are not replaced, and instead of "pushed" to the side, which makes them likely to contain ores behind them. But I may be wrong on that.
 * 5. This is entirely random; it could or could not mean a cave.

I can't recall exactly, but the roughly 10 X 10 Dirt patches "Center" Abandoned MineShafts, and yet are I think only 1 Block-deep, having Stone mostly underneath (or whatever-else, generated there). I've never found more AbMS passage(s) by digging-down, through the useful-to-navigation (as well as Farming) Dirt generated as-part of an AbMS.

(#*4.: ) Like Dirt anywhere, it doesn't-"Push" Ores, to the side, it simply Does, seem to replace, not re-place, them. I find Ores right-next to these, and Dungeons, on occasion when I mine those usually-underground surfaces, too. Yilante 50.1.134.10 11:01, 18 December 2013 (UTC)

How To Break Dirt/Blocks
How do I dig dirt and break blocks on my Mac? I grab shovels, hoes, whatever, but nothing. A little help.--MegaMinecraftWuvvvvver 23:11, 13 July 2013 (UTC)

Changes due to 1.7
So basically, there's two new dirt-ish things now: Podzol and this thing that is like regular dirt, but never grows Grass Blocks on itself. I like to think of it as permafrost. 76.24.37.165 00:44, 26 October 2013 (UTC)

“.. I like to think of it as permafrost;” given the absence of Snow in Mega Taiga Biomes, I’m gonna suggest we could equally call this “permaburn,” as it’s in the Mesa (“technical Biome”: Plateau F) Biomes’ Mesa-tops, a few of which have no Grass at all, but in any case, this almost “cooked”-looking faded land atop-Clay and a tiny fringe of Red Sand, do Not receive Grass, spreading. How about Perm-a /o'-Dirt? Dirt with its own "style," "permadirt." Yilante 50.1.134.10 10:49, 18 December 2013 (UTC)

Hmm, experimental “Dirt” /Grass results, almost immediately obtained: I Dug two Blocks of stuff that could-be converted into Dirt; one from the “Dirt” the Grass was Never, Spreading-onto, and one from the Grass, which was Not-Spreading, onto some nearby, “Dirt.”  I placed each - both as seemingly-”Dirt,” now - on the-opposite’s Block-type, with Both next-to /among Grass Blocks, Plural, so that they’d both have a High chance of turning-into Grass Blocks, themselves normally.

Both did, immediately it seems. It may be that once-Dug, this Grassless “Dirt” (or permafrost, permaburn, or permadirt), Becomes, Dirt: it might-have -also been that the former Grass Block, for its part, was able-to Spread-onto the larger patch of Grassless “Dirt,” as Grass again, because there is No, co-ordinate -type restriction on Where Grass Grows /Spreads, and where it doesn’t, Where instead it remains Grassless, “Dirt.” Yilante 50.1.134.10 19:26, 18 December 2013 (UTC)

Conditions For Converting into Grass Blocks
All of these rules only apply when the target block is touched by light (haven't tested the level yet though)

1. There must be no blocks touching the dirt block except for other dirt blocks. (air blocks are fine too)

2. Rule one does not apply if the target dirt block is also being touched by a grass block.

3. If a dirt block is floating in the air, it will not convert.

4. A dirt block that is on top of another block that is not dirt or grass will not convert.

5. Rule 4 Addendum: If the block directly below (one unit less on Y axis and same values for X and Z) is dirt, it must be surrounded by dirt or grass to convert the block above it.


 * This was all done on the Xbox 360 Edition*

Why is dirt & coarse dirt combined?
I know they do look similar, but if it's the fact that the block id is the same, why is Podzol separated? If you agree that they should be separated, let me know. I will do so if you guys agree :) Screenbones (talk) 06:58, 26 June 2014 (UTC)

Coarse Dirt
I think that we need to separate coarse dirt from normal dirt. Podzol is separated and is basically the same block with a few differences. ♥ LauraFi ♥ (talk) 14:08, 30 September 2014 (UTC)


 * There's a discussion over at Talk:Wet Sponge where we're trying to hash out maybe some rules we can follow, for what kinds of things get split and what don't; apparently there are a handful places on the wiki where people feel pages need split or merged, and not everybody agrees why – feel free to pipe up if you have ideas! – Sealbudsman (Aaron) SealbudsmanFace.png T, C, b 14:53, 30 September 2014 (UTC)


 * As for this case, I really don't see why podzol is separate, as they all have fundamentally the same usage, other than the mechanic of grass spread, and hoeing for coarse dirt. —KnightMiner  (t 15:09, 30 September 2014 (UTC)

Reboot
LauraFi began to draft a separate article for coarse dirt. I strongly. Coarse dirt is just generic dirt that is coarse. Meanwhile, podzol is a different type of soil, as it is in real life. —  NickTheRed37 t/c (f.k.a. Naista2002)  17:09, 21 April 2015 (UTC)
 * That's semantic. Coarse Dirt is arguably more distinct from ordinary dirt than podzol is, as it can be crafted with its own recipe. The name alone isn't a strong enough argument to pass them as the same block while making a distinction for another block that's mechanically highly similar. Not supporting or opposing- just pointing out that a wiki's policy on the "page-worthiness" of variants on a single item should be consistent. Gearzein (talk) 22:17, 22 April 2015 (UTC)
 * I don't use names alone, I use actual characteristics and logic. In real life, podzol is one of soil types, thus it would make sense to make in-game podzol like that (with generic dirt being another soil type). Meanwhile, coarse dirt is made of generic dirt and gravel... This could be a different type, really, so I'm now regarding to coarse dirt until we get more info. P. S. using recipes as an argument is usually unreliable. &mdash; NickTheRed37 t/c (f.k.a. Naista2002)  05:51, 23 April 2015 (UTC)

Instead of organizing by real life properties, it should really be sorted based on minecraft properties. In this case, dirt and coarse dirt have the same property of planting mushrooms and saplings, but that is shared by podzol, mycelium, and grass. Meanwhile dirt's main unique property is grass spreading to it, which coarse dirt lacks (making dirt more similar to podzol, but there are some other differences there. Because of those reasons, I agree with splitting coarse dirt (and the original grassless dirt too, as that is the same block, but with a different texture and name). – KnightMiner  t/c 17:09, 23 April 2015 (UTC)
 * I doubt that it is a good argument at all. Meanwhile, player character is controlled by a real-life human. Given that they have a knowledge of geology, podzol can be considered as a different soil type. Although why it shares its ID with dirt is unknown. &mdash; NickTheRed37 t/c (f.k.a. Naista2002)  06:44, 24 April 2015 (UTC)
 * The two share an ID because the game's code treats them the same in terms of distinction from other blocks in the game world- both are variants of an existing base item, using its general properties with slightly modified behavior. For example, there is only one Spawn Egg item, which uses its damage value to determine its appearance and behavior, rather than having a separate item per mob. Correspondingly, there is only one page for Spawn Eggs. If this wiki's intention is to serve as a resource to players of Minecraft, then the data recorded here has to be treated in the most pragmatic way in regards to gameplay, which necessarily means reflecting this behavior. An individual player's practical knowledge of geology means little when they need to know the properties of two items in a video game that, beyond name, have little in common with real-world science. By that same logic, content regarding enchantment and alchemy should be removed or tagged separately because magic isn't a real-world concept.
 * Not only is that a solid argument, but arguments relative to the stated game properties should be the only valid ones. Again, I'm not saying for or against in regards to the change itself, as I'm not familiar enough with this particular wiki's policy to make a call, but the treatment of blocks that are damage-value variants of other blocks should be relatively consistent across the board, not only in this matter but in others as well. It's illogical to say that one should be treated separately but another as a subset. Gearzein (talk) 12:22, 24 April 2015 (UTC)


 * . – LauraFi -  talk  01:09, 6 May 2015 (UTC)
 * - Its almost the same block with two small differences; texture and properties. That and also the fact that they both hame the same ID, so it should be kept like it is now (of course there are a few exceptions, such as Podzol since it has enough relevant information, but this isn't a plausible exception). --ToonLucas<b style="color: red">22</b> (talk</i>) 18:53, 21 May 2015 (UTC)
 * Podzol = Coarse Dirt (except for texture and coarse dirt can be tilled to become dirt) and it is separated... we should merge podzol instead. – LauraFi -  talk  19:13, 21 May 2015 (UTC)
 * The problem in my opinion: what similarity do dirt and coarse dirt have that is not also shared with grass and mycelium? – KnightMiner  t/c 03:53, 22 May 2015 (UTC)
 * Grass, podzol, mycelium and coarse dirt would all be different types of soil cover. Regular dirt composes lower layers. By NO MEANS, NO MEANS they should ALL be merged AT ALL. Now you get it? Also, will you ALL learn how I format opinion lists now? HUH? &mdash; Grid Command Block.png <b style=color:green>NickTheRed37</b> (talk&#124;contributions) 08:35, 22 May 2015 (UTC)
 * Please be civil in your comments. Failure to do so can result in being blocked from editing. --<b style="color: red">Toon</b><b style="color: blue">Lucas</b><b style="color: red">22</b> (talk</i>) 11:40, 22 May 2015 (UTC)
 * I know, but really... &mdash; Grid Command Block.png <b style=color:green>NickTheRed37</b> (talk&#124;contributions) 13:00, 22 May 2015 (UTC)
 * Again, real life ≠ Minecraft. – LauraFi -  talk  19:28, 22 May 2015 (UTC)
 * But all people who play the game are in real life and may use knowledge from it in the game. &mdash; Grid Command Block.png <b style=color:green>NickTheRed37</b> (talk&#124;contributions) 07:17, 23 May 2015 (UTC)
 * That isn't a good reason to merge/separate pages. – LauraFi -  talk  13:27, 23 May 2015 (UTC)
 * И почему же? And so why? &mdash; Grid Command Block.png <b style=color:green>NickTheRed37</b> (talk&#124;contributions) 08:04, 26 May 2015 (UTC)
 * I never said they all should be merged, I said the only shared property is too common to conciser it enough to merge dirt/coarse dirt but not enough for all the rest.
 * Also, the reason I do not use your formatting design (which I have never seen done by anyone else on this wiki) is because it is terrible to read on the editing screen and breaks way to easily (such as if someone inserts a quote). Also, if you are going to go with "required" formatting, go with the one suggested by the talk page guidelines – KnightMiner  t/c 02:15, 23 May 2015 (UTC)
 * , because they have the same properties. GRAND RADION (talk) 09:36, 1 September 2015 (UTC)
 * Are you disagreeing with my comment? If so, you did not read it as my main point was they don't have the same properties, they just have one shared property (the "dirt" aspect) which is also shared by mycelium and grass. – KnightMiner  t/c 13:41, 1 September 2015 (UTC)
 * On the Russian Minecraft Wiki then also need to split a page. GRAND RADION (talk) 06:23, 2 September 2015 (UTC)
 * This discussion is unrelated to the Russian Minecraft wiki. Propose this over there if you think it should be split there, as each language variant can decide for themselves how they wish to split and merge pages. – KnightMiner  t/c 22:53, 2 September 2015 (UTC)

with the spit proposal - there are far too many places on this article where separate distinctions are made between dirt and coarse dirt - it would make more sense to split the two articles. –<b style=color:#282>Goandgoo</b> ᐸ <small style="display:inline-block;line-height:1em;vertical-align:-0.4em">Talk Contribs 06:46, 15 November 2015 (UTC)